I mean, its a little bit like, Just keep saying yes. You know, When in doubt, say Sure, Ill do that, just to see what happens next, just to see who you might meet. We should thank the chef. Diane, Okay. Over 50 & Flourishing with Dominique Sachse. Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. I mean, that means shes with them. Kerri, They thrill, and confound, and circle, and overflow, and disappear, because its like this, having a life.. The ambiguity is quite isolating. Kate Bowler:Oh friend. Team Everything Happens, Kate, I think earn is such a good word, because youre talking about such a complicated math. In, warm, insightful, often funny conversations, Kate talks with people about what they've. One of the hardest things Ive been wrestling with is not having any clear language for this weird place between sick and healthy, weak and strong. But I asked the doctor what the right term for me might be, and he said Survivor-in-progress, which was super annoying. They swell, and constrict, and break, and forgive, and behold, because its like this, having a heart. It kind of reminded me though, when I was little, my family used to have these mottos, but the mottos were stuff like, Dont get crumbs on the baby, or Be nice to mom. A huge thank you to Mahra (the song she sings is from When I Drink by The Avett Brothers), Riham, and Cheryl who shared their family mottos with us. 00:35:25 - Annie Jean Baptiste in the Head of Product Inclusion at Google where she spends her time thinking about the products we use very day and how who's a Kelly Corrigan:I mean, unless youre a monk, and youre meditating for 60 days in a mountain somewhere. Shes not going to hold their babies.. I guess everybody here, these children of mine and my husband, are just too damn busy to get on this, but Im not, so Ill do it, and then I was finishing, and I found a little pile of cut toenails on my kitchen table, and that. Whos going to do this? Thank You for all you do!! You also realized there was incredible parenting magic in the phrase, Tell me more. So, what is this witchcraft you speak of? I was wrong, and that is very soothing, but then that took me back to this moment where I had gone to work for United Way after college, because I was going to save the world, and I was this total do-gooder. I was wrong not to try to ease her days in some way.. The Best Show with Tom Scharpling. Okay, but Im just telling you those kids are waking up every day without her, and theyre going to keep being without her forever. I mean, people are getting colon cancer at your age all the time. Absolutely enjoy these, the wisdom, the calm, the gentle reminder of our true reality and the essentiality of the connections we make and need to survive and help each other. PBS is a 501(c)(3) not-for-profit organization. The idea that we just sort of wander around, consume things until we die, like were just a series of small appetites without any deep, rich, meaningful, satisfying connection. They thrill, and confound, and circle, and overflow, and disappear, because its like this, having a life.. I dont have the genetic predisposition. Kate Bowler:Yeah, the indignity. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Its probably cause of something youve been eating. Kate Bowler:Theres this other phrase, I was wrong, that has real power, and you learned that in a really intense way when your grandma died. The voice memos at the end of the episode are from listeners like you! My mantra for the last decade plus has been show up and be of use. No one understands what makes a character sing better than Michael Lewis. Kate Bowler:Yeah, yeah, yeah. What do you do when life doesnt fit into neat categories? Please note that this episode references addiction and suicide. That kind of belonging is transcendent, and you just feel it pop up in these little moments. You know, I honestly think I only say Im sorry, and not, I was wrong. I think I might try it. Kelly Corrigan:And I should not lose my mind over a shirt I bought on final sale section that didnt fit even though I tried to pull it over myself, and then it got stuck on me, and I had to cut it off with scissors. A former newspaper columnist and four time bestselling author, Kelly wonders about loads of stuff: is knowing more always good? Each episode ends with a special Plus One segment, in which guests are invited to thank those that have supported them along their journey. My mom called me maybe three months after my dad died. You wrote this book in a season of incredible loss. Its all this cumulative effect of a thousand minuscule moments. It offers so much grace to us all who are struggling to do better and be better. It doesnt end, and also you cant live there. Just do your best. Kelly Corrigan:You cant be in the world, and get through your to-do list, and also sit in endless, rich gratitude. Thanks for sharing. If you haven't heard of Father Greg Boyle, let us introduce you: a Jesuit priest who has a touch of Santa Claus in his affect, Greg Boyle has collaborated with thousands of former gang members to build thriving businesses and communities of radical acceptance in East LA. The reach of language can be laughable.. Kelly Corrigan sits down with Melinda French Gates. Ryland was a light in this world who struggled with anxiety, depression and addiction. -Kilpy It just ends the tension because what youre saying is, I see it how you see it, and I agree with you. Im hearing all the music, Im totally tuned in to the right channel, and then just like that, I slip into those mundane irritants., Kelly Corrigan:And then I catch myself, and then I feel this sense of shame, and he said, Its like this. I really appreciate it. I heard your friend died, and I just couldnt bear to call them back. So, I was wondering, would you mind reading that beautiful passage you wrote about after Liz died? But the fact is if I said, Tell me more, go on, what else, youd say the next thing, and the next thing, and the next thing, and it would be like the thing behind the thing, behind the thing is where really the pain is, and if I had waited way longer, I wouldve been able to say, Oh, I understand.. Kate Bowler:You put in a strong argument, if I may say it like that, for just being close to one another. Playlist. I mean so far, knock on wood, Im getting to see my kids be much, much older than she got to see her kids be. All moments, days, chapters are transitory and the good ones leave us as do the bad ones. Kelly Corrigan:I sat at my dining room table, which is place I never write, and I thought, Oh my God, of course I know exactly what this is. Ive read Tell Me More twice already. This is an amazing story. The Honor and Weight of of Being a Role Model. Gratefully, The book is full of warm and witty blessings found within the struggles of our shared humanity, from theNew York Timesbestselling authors ofGood Enough. Kelly Corrigan:Thanks. Now, eleven years post-cancer, Im still learning to show up and be of use in my life, my marriage, my family and my work for the display of His splendor. He had things to do for days, and days, and days, and eulogies to write, and people to hug, and people to thank, and accounts to close, and cars to sell, and he had work to do, both emotional and just literally logistics. Warmly, Together, Kate and Kelly explore the phrases we cling to in order to find deeper connection and meaning during difficult times. Kate Bowler:Wow, and thats a big word. She reflects on her love and loss through ordinary moments and everyday sayings. Team Everything Happens. Were just a series of days and interactions. You wrote this book in a season of incredible loss. Kate Bowler:Well, your book has such a wonderful collection of phrases around essays, stuff like Tell me more, and you write about incredible things people can say when theyre figuring out the road ahead. I should not be mad about this. She totally doesnt get it. Were jumping in way too soon and talking way too much. Read more on this here. What do you do when life doesnt fit into neat categories? Kilpy Kelly Corrigan:I never came up with any combination that came close to the feeling. Dalai Lama XIV, Cheryl, We should thank the chef. I think we should be talking about five percent of the time. I didnt make her final days one bit better, and I lived there for two years. Im so sorry youre not going to like any of my answers. As Teri said, He didnt have a drug problem, he had a life problem. Its so that they can identify some critical difference between you and them that makes them feel like they can exhale again. Kate Bowler:Yeah, yeah, yeah. To learn more about Everything Happens for a Reason (and Other Lies Ive Loved) by Kate Bowler, click here. You wrote about the end of words. Neal Brennan and Kelly Corrigan have a conversation in NYC. Shed do anything. CW: death of parent, death of friend to cancer. Kate Bowler:Yeah, the indignity. He is also the father to three great characters, including Dixie, who was killed in a head on collision in May of 2021. One is called Yesterday and the other is called Tomorrow. After the potency of the crime metaphor wore off, I turned to the vocabulary of religion. I think people think that if you have a diagnosis, or somethings happened to you that you should know because youre proof of it. Kelly Corrigan:And thats the truth. So, todays conversation is about developing language to move us forward when life is well, chronic. It just ends the tension because what youre saying is, I see it how you see it, and I agree with you. And Ive talked to a couple of my girlfriends whove gotten divorced, and they say the exact same thing happens to them. Kate Bowler:Well, the one that we sort of settled on most was, Dont let the turkeys get you down, cause we were all deeply unpopular children, but it did make me think about mottos, and how it sort of defines the season that we live in. Despair defies description. But I asked the doctor what the right term for me might be, and he said Survivor-in-progress, which was super annoying. Like the other day when I was being wheeled into a procedure, the nurse looked at my chart, and then casually said, Colon cancer. We are so glad that you joined us for this conversation and found it enjoyable. Okay, great. Kelly Corrigan:And how do we earn it? Its completely random. Constance Wu also thanks a past educator of hers, Mr. Frizzle. May you find Christ, comfort, and companions amidst the questions! Kelly Corrigan Wonders on Apple Podcasts 296 episodes Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Im so glad youve been plugging in and hope to keep hearing your feedback! You are in good company. Go get mixed up in something. I end up saying to my therapy clients, to my friends, and to my daughter both Change is hard and the stage-specific version of CIH, Middles are awful. Middles are awful: we have to either find language for an ambiguous state or give up on finding it: hard, sweaty work. Her memoirs include " The Middle Place," and her first children's. Kate Bowler:You put in a strong argument, if I may say it like that, for just being close to one another. I go, Oh, thank you for that bit of suggestion.. Tell Me More with Kelly Corrigan is a series that inspires, educates and entertains. So, I grew up with this sentence with my fathers voice in my head saying, Allah Kareem, God is generous., Cheryl:Our family motto is, Dont eat a hamster. She has been called the voice of her generation and the poet laureate of the ordinary, and she is the most perfect person to talk to to kick us off because her lovely new book is called Tell Me More, and Tell me more is one of those phrases she uses, phrases that she writes about that help guide her through relationships, and parenting, and grief. Im like, Yeah, right. Best-selling author Kelly Corrigan tries a research-proven technique to feel closer to her husband. Kelly Corrigan:And Im getting to walk with them way longer on their road, and I felt this sense that I could never possibly deserve that, that Im not that great a person, or a mom. I didnt make her final days one bit better, and I lived there for two years. You wrote about the end of words. Kate Bowler:Well, your book has such a wonderful collection of phrases around essays, stuff like Tell me more, and you write about incredible things people can say when theyre figuring out the road ahead. I love it that it gives up perfectionism, and it just says, Hey, whats possible today?. My life doesnt exactly fit into neat categories anymore. Each episode ends with Kellys shortlist of takeaways, appropriate for refrigerator doors, bulletin boards and notes to your children. Kelly Corrigan:Well, chop-chop kid. Labels like chronic illness, or caregiver, or widow, or mom of a kid with special needs. This field is for validation purposes and should be left unchanged. Dont worry, and she said, Well, my problem is I cant zip my dress by myself, so I thought if it was a woman, I could ask her to come in, and zip my dress, and I thought, Thats the tiny moments that are so gut-wrenching for a new widow. Enjoy an intimate and heartfelt interview series hosted by author Kelly Corrigan.MoreMore. Kelly Corrigan:The magic of Tell me more is you start telling me what youre upset about, and I fall for the first thing you say, and I start solving for that. Then the ocean with its waves so vast, impossible to touch bottom, then a maze, then a mountain, then seasons, a natural disaster. In this season of "Tell Me More," listen to one-on-one conversations with musical icons like Jewel and Lang Lang, community leaders like Del Seymour, entertainment heavyweights like Constance Wu and Michael Lewis, scientists like Maya Shankar, and more. Kindly, Kelly Corrigan:And so I didnt do it. Its really wonderful to learn more about you and hear the ways youve connected with Kate and the book. Thats where relationship lives is in these tiny moments, and whether you are cognizant of that and tuned into that channel all the time, or not, that is the story of a relationship. Kelly Corrigan:I was perhaps proud about it honestly, and I was reading 7 Habits of Highly Effective People at night with my big fat yellow highlighter, and I was really full of attachment to this identity that I had painted for myself. Kelly Corrigan:And I should not lose my mind over a shirt I bought on final sale section that didnt fit even though I tried to pull it over myself, and then it got stuck on me, and I had to cut it off with scissors. Its the only way to keep the last bit of sanity. So much of what you both say resonates for me. Duration: 3:0 Transcript HARI SREENIVASAN: Now to another in our Brief But Spectacular. Kelly Corrigan:So, I used to go in there and write, and they have a meditation teacher twice a day at 10:00 AM and 3:00 PM, and at first I was sort of sheepish about availing myself of every single employee benefit, but sure enough, eventually I found myself sitting in there, and this guy was kind of amazing. Corrigan and her guests dig into such questions as "Is knowing more always . Our family motto: It isnt help unless someone asks for it. Team Everything Happens. The result is "Think Twice: Michael Jackson," a 10-part podcast from Audible and Wondery that will be available exclusively on Audible and Amazon Music on Thursday. He was saddled with depression and anxiety, which led to his trying to make himself feel better and reduce the noise in his head. This beautiful eulogy helps to paint the full picture of Ryland: a unique combination of funny, stubborn, difficult and smart. Use one of the services below to sign in to PBS: You've just tried to add this video to My List. Kelly Corrigan speaks with Maya Shankar about identity foreclosure, the trouble of cognitive forecasting, and new beginnings. She lives in Philly and I live in California. Theres a whole world out there happening, and you can step into all kinds of things, and you dont need to know why youre leaving the house. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. She plans to give it to her daughter, who graduates from high school in June.. It just came out whole, and of course, to me its the most important and moving chapter in the book for sure. Kelly Corrigan:So, my husband worked at a startup in San Francisco, which is called Medium, and its a writing platform, and as a writer, I was welcome to come, and use their office space, and its everything you think a San Francisco startup is. Its a very learned thing that I have to insert the words into my mouth, and push them out deliberately, because my instinct is to solve. Kelly Corrigan:Well you know, its so funny. I went to see her one time. The idea that any day could be this huge day, I dont know, that really gets me out of bed, you know? So, its funny that that phrase really begat the whole book in a way, because I had been feeling this shame about not really earning my days here, and then Ed and I were at dinner, and we were talking about the difference between saying Im sorry, and saying I was wrong, and I was saying, God, its so much more powerful though in the humility in saying I was wrong.. I didnt do it. For what Ive just seen in the last six months, I should be different. Onwards! You are everywhere they are., Kelly Corrigan:I really believe that, even though Im skeptical, and Im mad at people who say, Her spirits still here, and stuff. Theyre poking for that critical difference to hold on to, and I wanna hug em, and say, I know. I mean, maybe I was projecting, maybe whatever he said in that moment, maybe if he had said peanut butter, and jelly, wed be talking about peanut butter and jelly, but it totally resonated for me in the way that a song lyric does where youre like, I dont know what that means exactly, but Im going to write that down, and put it in my wallet, and its interesting. Kelly Corrigan:So, I used to go in there and write, and they have a meditation teacher twice a day at 10:00 AM and 3:00 PM, and at first I was sort of sheepish about availing myself of every single employee benefit, but sure enough, eventually I found myself sitting in there, and this guy was kind of amazing. Inspiring and thought-provoking interviews conducted by bestselling author Kelly Corrigan. Team Everything Happens. 5:55. Shes not going to hold their babies.. Best, Its not in my family. Kelly Corrigan:I never came up with any combination that came close to the feeling. Jennifer Garner tells Kelly Corrigan how she inspires others to find their true passions. Kelly has also agreed to be my friend as part of her contractual commitment to this podcast. Kelly Corrigan:My friend Andy Lotts, who is Lizs husband, told me about it, cause hes a mom now, and so we talk mom talk. I was so mad that I shook the cage a bit, that hamster eating its sibling. I was in a big, big rush to get in front of him, and say my apology, and be returned to a state of grace, but the fact is that his mom died. Kate Bowler:Those ordinary consonants and vowels that, when strung together, offer meaning and points of entry for others. Kilpy I dont know, but a whole new world of possibilities exist right now that did not exist an hour and 10 minutes ago, and I think that is so cool, and real, and exciting. Kelly Corrigan:She cant wear half her clothes because she cant zip them by herself. Kilpy I was wrong, and that is very soothing, but then that took me back to this moment where I had gone to work for United Way after college, because I was going to save the world, and I was this total do-gooder. Kelly Corrigan:Like, almost every time Im sure that if you just let me take over, I can make this problem go away. Kelly Corrigan:Its like a game changer. I need to hear what your motto is. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. Her teams look to her for direction, but she wanted to see what would happen if she paused more to ask them questions, and found it totally changed her approach to both her work and family life. Kate Bowler:Today, I get a chance to talk to Kelly about some of her very best phrases. Thats like total vanity but, especially with the kids, I definitely think, Edward and I both think, If you let us run this out for you, well get it done like one, two, three, and thats so humiliating, and degrading, and just the opposite of self-esteem building, which is sort of like the ground we walk on as adults. After the potency of the crime metaphor wore off, I turned to the vocabulary of religion. Kelly Corrigan:Thanks. Kelly Corrigan:So, I say at the end of this chapter, Shouldnt loss change a person for the better? Copyright 2023 Public Broadcasting Service (PBS), all rights reserved. She's a daughter who still mourns the loss of her dad, a mom to her amazing daughters, a wife to her fantastic husband, a sister, a good friend, and a woman trying her best to leave this world a better and a brighter one for future generations. And the potted plant theory, I cant credit it to someone, Im sorry, I dont know who put it out there, but the idea is that if you were to have a plant in your kitchen, you might not be aware of it at all, and then if someone were to remove it, youd say What happened to that plant?. So, I just really went bananas, because on top of the shirt problem, I went downstairs to clean the kitchen, and I found everybodys bowls, and spoons, and cups, and I had that reaction that so many women have, which is, Well I guess Im the least busy. Kelly Corrigan:Like, Oh, well we still have sex, so were definitely not going to get a divorce, or you know, Oh my husband doesnt travel, so then were definitely not gonna get a divorce, or you know, I never smoked cigarettes, so Im definitely not going to get breast cancer. Ill definitely remember this motto and will probably end up using it, if you dont mind . Nobody who is between identities they can tolerate does, it seems to me something Ive actively struggled with and expect to go hand to hand with again, whether tomorrow or the day after. Kelly Corrigan:Like, Oh, well we still have sex, so were definitely not going to get a divorce, or you know, Oh my husband doesnt travel, so then were definitely not gonna get a divorce, or you know, I never smoked cigarettes, so Im definitely not going to get breast cancer. Simply becauseIts like this or, my current favorite: Its a species behavior., Nan, Stay healthy. What do we do when the labels we're given aren't necessarily the ones we choose for ourselves? They hate it. Kelly Corrigan:So, she had to call someone and ask them to come over and zip her dress so she could go to the wedding. Michael Lewis and Kelly Corrigan in Lafayette, CA. Team Everything Happens. Go get mixed up in something. Your email address will not be published. But first, we need you to sign in to PBS using one of the services below. Its so that they can identify some critical difference between you and them that makes them feel like they can exhale again. Kate Bowler:Absolutely. Kelly Corrigan:So, my dad died in February, and then my friend Liz, whos the mother of three kids, 8, 10, and 12 at the time, died that December. Welcome to Kelly Corrigan Wonders, a place for people who like to laugh while they think and find it useful to look closely at ourselves and our weird ways in the hopes that knowing more and feeling more will help us do more and be better. Thats my other life mantra. So, I think things happen when you leave the house. Yeah. But the fact is if I said, Tell me more, go on, what else, youd say the next thing, and the next thing, and the next thing, and it would be like the thing behind the thing, behind the thing is where really the pain is, and if I had waited way longer, I wouldve been able to say, Oh, I understand.. She's an author. We look forward to having you join in on future conversations! Kelly Corrigan Wonders listeners will be familiar with Alexs story as we shared it in the episode A Mother Son Story of the Ultimate Transition and it was also replayed it in the For the Good of the Order feed. Kelly Corrigan:And it wasnt my turn for his attention. Kilpy Kelly Corrigan:Sure, my pleasure. I was wrong not to go visit her. Click here for discussion questions for this podcast episode. Kelly Corrigan:Well you know, sometimes the trivial is tragic. We should hold hands for a moment, as a way of marking the glory of a family dinner, and they do that. Hes just one of those people that you think, God, if I could get five minutes with him, Id just tell him my biggest problem, and hed just say something in seven words that would solve everything., Kelly Corrigan:So, eventually I went up to him, and I said, Im caught between these two worlds, this world where Im full of clarity and insight and gratitude, and Im seeing all the big colors of the world. They reel and wander and fixate and roll back and reconsider, because its like this, having a mind. I didnt engage with her. It doesnt end, and also you cant live there. I think we make life a little more interesting! She lives in Philly and I live in California. Kelly Corrigan:Now maybe Im going to go to Durham, and now maybe Im going to get my PhD in Divinity. Ask the dancers, and the athletes, the painters, and musicians. I think thats cause we were always sort of fighting nearby. Download. Im sorry I didnt go see your mom. Thats not the same as saying I was wrong not to try to know her. Such is a reminder that success is the result of joined efforts and that all of us are touched by the ripples of others contributions. Kelly shares a graduation speech, a conversation about takeaways from high school with her daughter and a special reading with Oscar winning actress Helen Hunt. Even the words left unsaid. Enjoy an intimate and heartfelt interview series hosted by author Kelly Corrigan. Gratefully, I was wondering if you could tell me about that. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us Hebrews 12:1 I didnt do it. I mean, I remember thinking, when I wasnt sure, when I was in an especially tough moment of illness, every time I would look at Zachs nails I would think, Is this what wouldve happened if I hadnt been here to do this? This is the way this has to be, and its right there. What a unique family motto! Ill definitely have to write this one down and bring it out on a particularly overwhelming day! On Sundays, Kelly records a special podcast called, "Thanks for Being Here" where she reads the toasts and tributes that listeners have submitted about those they love. Hosted by four-time New York Times bestselling author Kelly Corrigan, the show dives deep into each guests life to pull out poignant lessons they hope others can use to find their own calling or better understand themselves. Kelly Corrigan:Im telling you what, man, you can not believe how much I use this, and you can not believe how still it is not my natural instinct. Kelly Corrigan:Youre feeling like ABC, not DEF. So thats the beauty of it. For Dr. White was the first person who ever told Michael he could write. I absolutely love that phrase. Its completely random. You start with, Its like this.. You cant live in that. Theyre poking for that critical difference to hold on to, and I wanna hug em, and say, I know. Kelly Corrigan:Have you ever heard that potted plant theory? When I read that, I just kept thinking of how scared Ive been about what I call being a zombie. Kelly Corrigan:I know, me too. Kate Bowler:You are someone who has gotten mixed up in all kinds of things, and I am so glad to know you. A phrase that I heard at a recent Pecha Kucha talk from a woman who had come through a terrible health crisis was Its like this now. On days when I feel overwhelmed, I tell myself all I need to do is maintain the faith and exit with grace. This interview is perfection. Kate Bowler:Yeah. The ambiguity is quite isolating. Del Seymour and Kelly Corrigan in Lafayette, CA. Then I wanted to get right with him, and urgently. Kelly Corrigan:Have you ever heard that potted plant theory? Kelly Corrigan:Theyre never going to not do that, and thats how theyre going to raise their kids, and that means shes still here. Weeks later, the missing hamster crawled out from under the stove. She was really, really into manners, and as kind of an act of gratitude, not in an uptight, British way, but as a Look at us eating a meal together, like, Nobody should eat before the last person gets down. Onwards, but you use it so beautifully when youre talking about Lizs family and how they are now. Kelly Corrigan:Youre feeling like ABC, not DEF. So thats the beauty of it. Today, Im speaking with New York Times bestselling author, Kelly Corrigan. Now a cognitive scientist and podcaster, Maya grew up immersed in the . Ten days before I was scheduled to defend my dissertation, English Policies, Curricular Reform and Teacher Development in Multilingual, Post-colonial Djibouti, I got the call.
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